I've really been itching for a CRX swap: '88 or early '89 (i.e. prior to 89.5 when they changed the seatbelt setup for the heavier doors). I have an early '89 HF, but I've always been jealous of the Si moonroof. Anyway, I thought if I could find one of the early Si cars I could swap my HF motor & transmission in. I have three questions with regards to this:

1) would the CRX's open moonroof be detramental to good FE? (bear in mind they do have that nice little tilt to them to help w/airflow, when open.

2) Is there a WEBSITE ANYWHERE that can tell me the difference between the weight of an '88 Si and HF? (All of them just seem to bunch all of the 88-91's together...but I know I have the lighter 2nd gen HF...not the heavier one that came with the seatbelt changes and whatnot).

3) I figured if the Si body's (since I'll be swapping my engine, remember) is about the same weight as my HF, I would want to know if I can get away with a straight up swap with keeping the Si's wiring harness intact. ...These cars are supposed to have the same wiring harness (Si & Hf).

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GAS GSLR

1. Yeah, prolly, how much Iono.
2. Check the honda-tech EF forum faq thread
3. HF also has egr, correct? Incorrect? I'm starting to forget all this crap...but it should be a straight swap with only one or two things...

HF has EGR, will require transferring over the EGR "Black Box" not hard to do.

From personal experience owning a 91 CRX Si and removing the Sunroof and replacing it with a 3 lb fiberglass plug, I dropped 28 pounds from the top of the car. I also removed ~20 lbs of sound deadening that was in the Si model as opposed non in the HF model. Taking in account of the differences in and under the dash between the two models, HF has no clock, usually no A/C (which means no A/C components under the dash, no tilt, no Dead Pedal, no rear wiper controls... this ends up being about a 150lb difference in weight between an 88 HF and an 88 Si model. Taking in account the door mounted seatbelts, bigger Door impact beams (88s didn't even have them) and a few other reinforcement differences (HFs have a different front bumper support, WAAYY different/lighter) The difference between an 88 Hf and 91 Si was just under 300lbs difference. Even the 91 HF was ~150 heavier than the 88 model.

You can swap out the 90-91 doors for the 88 model doors and install pillar mounted seatbelts into a door mounted system (requires welding in one or two nuts per side) As well as swapping over some of the Delete plates and vents that the HF uses.

Having the sunroof open disrupts the airflow over the top of the CRX badly when it is in it's fully open (slid back) position. It hangs over the hatchback a ways and creates a bi eddy behind it.

Hope some of this info helps.

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Honda Civic VX Info/Links
Remember to use good Webiquette!

hmm. That does help. Thanks a lot!

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GAS GSLR

I'm with TomO: the external tilt & slide sunroof on the CRX would easily make a measurable difference in FE at highway speeds because it destroys the airflow down the otherwise ideally shaped hatchback of that car.

If I had to rank sunroof designs from bad to terrible, aerodynamically:

bad: internal sliding with no permanent "deflector" ahead of it & pop-up deflector when open
worse: same as above, but with permanent external deflector
terrible: external tilt & sliding

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FF
ForkenSwift cheap electric car conversion- Geo Metro fuel economy mpg modifications

I understand that this thread is as old as dirt, but I was just wondering how much of a difference in mileage the weight difference makes between the two. I just need a rough estimate to see if it is worth purchasing a si shell or to keep searching for a hf shell which is becoming harder to find.

A couple of MPG per 100 pounds with the HF powerplant. The problem is putting an HF engine & tranny combo into the Si body is a bad thing.

You are MUCH better off putting a VX engine & tranny into an Si body. Bit more complex but much more bang for the buck.

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Looking to trade for an early 1988 Honda CRX HF (Pillar mounted seat belts)
http://www.gassavers.org/gaslog/sig.php?id=1121

That's exactly what I'm doing but I'm having a hard time trying to find an HF, especially the 88. I have the engine and ECU ready and am picking up a harness soon. It's like having a VCR with no TV.

1989 HF: 1834 pounds
1989 SI: 2138 pounds

The BIG reason for this large weight difference is that 1989 CRXs are unique in the sense that the HF has no door seatbelts, while the DX and SI DO.

If you cannot find an early HF, I suggest finding a 1988 DX model. DXs are MUCH easier to find, since SO many people have such a GREAT fear of the DPFI-MPFI conversion (which isn't even hard). And the 1988 DX is the ONLY 2G CRX DX that does not have door mounted seatbelts. It weighs 1922 pounds. And because it has no sunroof, it is not at all hard to bring the weight down to HF levels simply by swapping bolt-on parts.

What about a 90 hf? I just found one for sale that looks pretty clean inside and out. He wants $500 for it and it includes some nice wheels, stock si engine, and a b18 with tranny. Problem is that I have to drive about 4 1/2 hours to pick it up on friday. How much of a weight difference between an 88 and 90 hf?

My HF has both a clock and A/C. I know A/C was an option but I thought all came with clocks.
My 91 HF has the door mounted seatbelts but also has all of the holes and nuts installed for pillar mounted, no modification required.

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1990-1991 HF - 1967 pounds.

curb weight on my registration for my 90 crx hf is 1940lbs

my hf came with ac, i removed it.
my hf did not come with a clock.

90 hf looks better than an 89 (bumper, tail lights, dash)

is the vx engine and transmission that much better than a hf engine and transmission?

i know the seats in an SI weigh a decent amount more than the hf seats, Si seats are so much nicer.

Well I was supposed to pick it up friday, but unfortunately my truck doesn't have a tow hitch to tow it with a dolley from uhaul. I'm probably going to put a down payment and just pick it up next week. I'm just really eager to drop that d15z1 in it. It has the original hf seats, but I just don't like them and will probably end up swapping them with the si seats.

It was kind of funny seeing my Denali tow my HF home when I bought it. One of the worst offenders of FE towing one of the best FE cars of all time. I did however employ hypermiling techniques on the tow home and was able to yield 16.5mpg for the 120 mile trip home on windy hilly roads, which wasn't too shabby.

I need to replace the seats in my HF too. The foam has completely disintegrated in several places and you can feel the metal frame when you sit in it. I would like to find a set of seats that weigh less than the HF's though.

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