Official Thread for posting daily FE updates

[95metro]

Originally Posted by SVOboy

Normal people get 30mpg on your car, that's just how it is!

I agree with SVOboy, Dan. Most people think that the EPA numbers are overinflated, but you simply destroyed those numbers. I would say that the biggest part of your FE numbers is from your driving style.

If you start hitting similar percentages in the VX that will be truly amazing.

[SVOboy]

70% over 50mpg is...

[krousdb]

Originally Posted by 95metro

I agree with SVOboy, Dan. Most people think that the EPA numbers are overinflated, but you simply destroyed those numbers. I would say that the biggest part of your FE numbers is from your driving style.

If you start hitting similar percentages in the VX that will be truly amazing.

I have had this discussion before with MetroMPG. We have hypothesized that the high FE models are optimized such that it would be much more difficult to exceed EPA estimates than with non FE models. For example, the VX motor has less internal friction and has a lower idle speed to save fuel. IIRC that article I posted said that it was good for 3-5%. Well that shows up in the EPA numbers accordingly. But with CODfishing, both the FE and non FE cars realize the same benefit so the non FE car will get better % over EPA because it's EPA numbers didnt go up.

Capish?

[SVOboy]

Indeed, but the vx also has things like leanburn that can be abused to no end while the car is on! And besides that, you'll figure something out,

[krousdb]

Originally Posted by SVOboy

Indeed, but the vx also has things like leanburn that can be abused to no end while the car is on! And besides that, you'll figure something out,

You are beginning to sound like Phil!

Anyway I am a little concerned that for some reason the lean burn won't work after 130k miles. Maybe the O2 sensors need to be replaced? Anyway, is lean burn purely mechanical via the valvetrain or is there another interaction with the O2 sensors and / or ECU?

I have already been thinking about how to abuse lean burn, driving in a similar manner as when I drove the Insight at the TDS. But my good FE now comes from EOC downhill and normal uphill driving. Unless I can maintain lean burn up a hill, I don't see much difference possible. But the real diff will be on the highway by a PLB technique (Pulse & Lean Burn). I doubt that lean burn will be able to maintain 55MPH. But a pulse up to 65 and lean burn down to 50 may have potential. We shall see.

[SVOboy]

Only one o2 sensor. Anyway, lean burn is a completely electrical thing. You'll just have to see, it's a touchy system, at best.

[95metro]

Originally Posted by krousdb

I have had this discussion before with MetroMPG. We have hypothesized that the high FE models are optimized such that it would be much more difficult to exceed EPA estimates than with non FE models. For example, the VX motor has less internal friction and has a lower idle speed to save fuel. IIRC that article I posted said that it was good for 3-5%. Well that shows up in the EPA numbers accordingly. But with CODfishing, both the FE and non FE cars realize the same benefit so the non FE car will get better % over EPA because it's EPA numbers didnt go up.

Capish?

True, I've noted MetroMPG's statements to that effect, but even he is 40% over EPA now in an FE car. So, going by the VX's EPA rating...(why are there two ratings on the EPA site? Is the lower the CA model?) you are looking at a 51.5 mpg average.

10% = 56.65 mpg
20% = 61.8 mpg
30% = 66.95 mpg (there's your Del Sol numbers)
40% = 72.1 mpg
50% = 77.25 mpg

Personally I think you'll be hitting 70 mpg pretty quickly. Maybe add some aeromods to shoot you into the 80s...??? You're not giving yourself enough credit man! lol

[Matt Timion]

If Basjoos can get 60+ MPG in his CX (it's a CX, right?) then there is no reason you shoudn't be able to get 60-70mpg with the right aero mods.

use that extra $2k and buy a one piece front end (hood, fenders). you'll have no seams at all!

Good luck however getting access to the engine for any routine maintenance.

[hawkgt647]

Originally Posted by krousdb

...Unless I can maintain lean burn up a hill, I don't see much difference possible. But the real diff will be on the highway by a PLB technique (Pulse & Lean Burn). I doubt that lean burn will be able to maintain 55MPH. But a pulse up to 65 and lean burn down to 50 may have potential. We shall see.

Driving the Insight, if it's a fair comparison, will hold lean burn up to about 53 mph. On straight level roads. If a tail-wind is helping, 55mph is doable.

But lean burn has different levels. What I'm speaking of is holding 53 mph while maintaining 90-100 mpg on the iFCD.

It will also hold 60 mph at a lower lean burn level, maybe something like 75 mpg, which feels like the lower end of the lean burn "window".

And it will hold lean burn up a hill, you just watch the speed drop off

Regards,

[krousdb]

Originally Posted by Matt Timion

If Basjoos can get 60+ MPG in his CX (it's a CX, right?) then there is no reason you shoudn't be able to get 60-70mpg with the right aero mods.

use that extra $2k and buy a one piece front end (hood, fenders). you'll have no seams at all!

Good luck however getting access to the engine for any routine maintenance.

I wasn't aware of a one piece front end? Where can I find one? I wonder how much weight savings that would be? The VX is already 200lb less than the Del Sol.

[krousdb]

Originally Posted by Matt Timion

If Basjoos can get 60+ MPG in his CX (it's a CX, right?) then there is no reason you shoudn't be able to get 60-70mpg with the right aero mods.

One more thing to consider, althought Basjoos does have a CX body and tranny, he has a DX engine. He mentioned that he didn't notice a FE difference with the DX engine.

[SVOboy]

I imagine his cx engine was a bit fux0red, like the one I got,

Anyway, the one piece front end is a drag car type of thing made of fiberglass, it'd involve a ton of cost getting is rigged up but they def make them for the EG hatch.

Anyway, you'll do fine, don't worry.

[krousdb]

Originally Posted by SVOboy

Only one o2 sensor. Anyway, lean burn is a completely electrical thing. You'll just have to see, it's a touchy system, at best.

Im not liking the sound of that statement. You mean that lean burn is so touchy that It may not work because the car is old? If it is just electrical, what would need to be replaced to make it work again?

[SVOboy]

It's so touchy it may not work because it forgot how to one day, and the funny thing is that you never really no, cuz a lot of times things will be messed up but it won't code.

I'm not really an expert, I'd just advise you to drive it and see what kinda mileage you get, and that'll be your best indication of how it's working.

Usually the o2 sensor will get lazy or something though.

[budomove]

Since this past friday when Ben (SVO) helped swap in an hf transmission, I have gone from a base of 37mpg to 44mpg. That is not trying, whereas before I got 43-44mpg driving less aggressive, and EOCing, I am hoping for around 50mpg with those same practices. We shall see!

[zpiloto]

nice!

[Gary Palmer]

Impressive! That's it, the only change was to an HF transmission? What engine do you have? Is it DPFI or MPFI? What ECU?

[SVOboy]

D15b1, Dpfi, Pm5 Ecu?

[budomove]

Yeah, Ben got it right. d15b1, dpfi, and I guess it is a pm5 ecu, though I'm not sure. Life is good with 5th gear. mpfi/head swap in future I hope!

[Jack]

I finally got to 50 MPG. Just made it and that was with rain and wet weather every day this tank.

[SVOboy]

Uh oh! CRXs might be taking over, too bad Dan doesn't have one.

[Jack]

Originally Posted by SVOboy

Uh oh! CRXs might be taking over, too bad Dan doesn't have one.

I need to get a HF tranny and I would be all set.

[SVOboy]

Go ahead and get one, mine was free,

[krousdb]

Originally Posted by SVOboy

Uh oh! CRXs might be taking over, too bad Dan doesn't have one.

Why would I need one....

92 HB VX = 2094 lbs, CD 0.31
91 CRX DX = 2103 lbs, CD 0.30
91 CRX HF = 1967 lbs, CD 0.29

[SVOboy]

Because you would help them take over...

That was the point at least, anyway, for that matter I could say 88 HF = 1819 pounds,

[krousdb]

I see. I took that the wrong way.

[Jack]

Originally Posted by SVOboy

Because you would help them take over...

That was the point at least, anyway, for that matter I could say 88 HF = 1819 pounds,

That is how I took it too. Also It would be REAL nice to see what kind of numbers you are getting to help inspire the rest of us to do that little bit more that we can.

[Jack]

I just remembered to look...... I cracked the top 10 by .01.

[SVOboy]

Whenever the Dan-Ben meet happens he'll be driving mine,

Anyway:

52.7 MPG to work
57.5 MPG home

Home was poking at my record, but not quite there, things are improving.

[95metro]

Originally Posted by SVOboy

52.7 MPG to work
57.5 MPG home

Nice numbers. Was the difference due to weather/heat or driving style?