2008 Smart fortwo 400 mile review - Page 5 - Gas Savers

**theholycow** · 10-30-2008, 06:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VetteOwner

new cars yea usually a stupid sensor goes out and the computer doesnt know what to do so it freaks out and runs like crap...

In my experience, a couple stupid sensors die and the computer just deals with it, running fine on the data it gets from everywhere else. Then, plug in a scanner, and it takes you right to the sensor. Test the sensor, if it's bad replace it, if it's good then you get to fix a problem before it breaks other stuff (or ignore it).

I too like the simplicity of older cars, but really...even when they were new you couldn't buy them and only do oil changes for 100,000 miles, one tuneup, and then drive another 100,000 miles without a repair.

The only problem my 180,000 mile old 2002 model truck has had that wouldn't happen in an old-tech car is a fuel injection pressure leak. It runs fine and I'm getting 33% over EPA, but I have to turn the key to "On" and wait a couple seconds for the fuel pump to prime before I crank the starter.

Other problems, which would have happened regardless of technology: Wheel bearings (lots of them), an oil leak, and corroded tailgate cables.

Wazabi Owner · 11-30-2008, 08:28 AM

18,400 miles as of 11/29/08

On my other Smart, I am building a lightweight small trailer....3' wide x 4' long...... for when I need to take a trip with a good amount of luggage (frame is done, just need a box on it). This will solve the supposed problem everyone seems to think the Smart has of no luggage space. Up to about 21k miles combined miles and they have been my primary driver, I've yet to really see a huge problem we Americans feel of not enough space in our cars for the "what if" scenarios.

BEEF · 11-30-2008, 06:33 PM

there is the fact that only 2 people fit. that has been the deciding factor with me (along with the crap economy that we live in). my wife and I have decided to stick with the two vehicles that we have now. I was also a huge advocate for the third vehicle. it is always good to have a spare. I just can't afford one right now.

I have test drove one myself. I am an odd shaped fellow (no, I won't repeat that) I am 220 pounds and 5'7". I used to be closer to 250. I was experimenting with weight reduction lol. my wife is comperable but 5'3" so we are not small. we test drove one together and had no issues with space or pickup. the trans was strange until we started manually shifting with the paddle shifters. that worked much better.

in some ways, I regret not taking advantage of the smart (I was actually called about one and turned it down) but with gas prices going down, they may be easier to get a hold of if I change my mind. I am actually hoping for them to come out with a manual trans (normal manual) for it and also they have a system where the car cuts off when at stop lights and starts when teh accelerator is pressed (currently not available in the US) I can't remember what the system is called.

I say to anyone that wonders about these little cars, test drive one. they are a blast to drive and they turn on a dime.

**theholycow** · 11-30-2008, 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BEEF

I am actually hoping for them to come out with a manual trans (normal manual) for it and also they have a system where the car cuts off when at stop lights and starts when teh accelerator is pressed (currently not available in the US) I can't remember what the system is called.

The engine-off system won't be compatible with the manual transmission, for sure.

Wazabi Owner · 11-30-2008, 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theholycow

The engine-off system won't be compatible with the manual transmission, for sure.

I do go and pop it into neutral and shut off the engine at lights I'm familiar with and know I'll be sitting at for over 30 or more seconds. Pretty simple as all you have to do is pop it into drive. Mentioned this to the "know it all Smart owners and threw them into absolute fits. Same goes with mention of grille blocks, warm air intakes or anything else a lot of us do here.

Very closed minded bunch which I find quite surprising for some people that drive such a peculiar car.

Just turned over 18,500 miles today.

BEEF, it sounds like we are along the same Little Debbie physical fitness program though I'm about 2 inches taller and 20 pounds lighter

**theholycow** · 11-30-2008, 07:22 PM

I guess driving a Smart doesn't make them smart, they've got the same closed minds as any other auto forum users.

I just talked about WAI in a thread on standardshift.com where someone asked about the effect of CAI on FE, saying that his FE has gone down with his CAI. There were a million responses that a CAI would increase FE. We'll see how that goes over...

Wazabi Owner · 11-30-2008, 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theholycow

I guess driving a Smart doesn't make them smart, they've got the same closed minds as any other auto forum users.

I just talked about WAI in a thread on standardshift.com where someone asked about the effect of CAI on FE, saying that his FE has gone down with his CAI. There were a million responses that a CAI would increase FE. We'll see how that goes over...

I talked to another Smart owner yesterday that installed a CAI, said his mileage went instantaneously from 42mpg to 30mpg with no change in driving habits.

Mentioned he promptly removed it. Good as my dad has been dying to do put one on his Smart since I refuse to - he wants to be different but now he changed his mind since he has been getting a steady 45mpg last few tanks though he doesn't keep logs.

When I mentioned the WAI there I was literally burned at the stake and told in not so many words I was stupid even after I said I had proven it's worth with installs on my Geo Metro and my Honda Insight. They swore up and down that the CAI is the only way to go because it produces horsepower and an engine with more hp makes less work to propel the car which in turn will get better mileage and anyone that installs a WAI is dumb. Instead of arguing more and more I decided to shut up and color. Same few guys who "say" they are engineers are the bashers of the grill blocks, skirts, smooth wheel covers, tails/lip wings etc.

Mike T · 11-30-2008, 07:53 PM

Mine is at 66,000 miles and all is well.

**theholycow** · 11-30-2008, 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wazabi Owner

When I mentioned the WAI there I was literally burned at the stake and told in not so many words I was stupid even after I said I had proven it's worth with installs on my Geo Metro and my Honda Insight.

That's pretty much the normal reaction. I try really hard to phrase it in such a way as to avoid complete stake-body combustion.

Quote:

They swore up and down that the CAI is the only way to go because it produces horsepower and an engine with more hp makes less work to propel the car which in turn will get better mileage

LOL, by that measure we should be putting 454ci V8s in everything.

There's three types of FE opinions common on non-FE forums:
1. Anything that makes more power makes more FE.
2. Anything that makes less power makes more FE.
3. Getting good FE is morally objectionable.

Quote:

Same few guys who "say" they are engineers are the bashers of the grill blocks, skirts, smooth wheel covers, tails/lip wings etc.

Yup, sounds about right.

Wazabi Owner · 11-30-2008, 08:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theholycow

That's pretty much the normal reaction. I try really hard to phrase it in such a way as to avoid complete stake-body combustion.

LOL, by that measure we should be putting 454ci V8s in everything.

There's three types of FE opinions common on non-FE forums:
1. Anything that makes more power makes more FE.
2. Anything that makes less power makes more FE.
3. Getting good FE is morally objectionable.

Yup, sounds about right.

Yeah, I guess we should have beastly engines in everything by their rights. That being said, I do get pretty good mileage in my blown 350 if I keep my foot out of it which barely ever happens. 350 is the biggest motor I have in anything, got a 327, 305 and 302 for V-8's in some of my cars. All get crappy mileage which is why they sit.

Mike T - I'll catch up with you soon buddy!

BEEF · 12-01-2008, 08:48 AM

I work with engineers so I can relate. I am an engineering tech. one thing that I notice is that a lot of engineers tend to get tunnel vision when talking about certain subjects.

they tend to go with the norm because at some point, some engineer must have come up with it. basically they go with previous data instead of gathering the data themselves. being the guy that gathers the data, I would rather find out for myself.

I have suprised quite a few engineers with my cav as it gets 40+ percent over epa and it isn't a stick.

thisisntjared · 12-01-2008, 05:25 PM

is the smart map or maf driven? a 25+% drop in fuel economy is horrendous. is a cai really making that much more power??? i guess since the car is really "cute" there are a lot of uninformed owners...

anyway, what gives the extra power for the cold air intakes isnt really so much the cold air as it is the volume of air between the filter and the throttle body and how that volume is shaped. of course the power gains (or losses) are different for every car depending on what is changed

maximilian · 03-16-2009, 12:54 PM

I really wanted a Fortwo, until they dumped the diesel engine in the U.S. It's interesting to compare the dimensions and performance with the Isetta. I assume the huge weight increase of the Fortwo is all about crash safety. I've known people who call them ugly, but they seem elegant to me, as does the Fortwo for that matter.

homeslice · 05-08-2009, 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike T

My car has the upgraded sound option, which is pretty decent - bass reflex boxes, tweeters, pretty good, but not Bose or Harmon Kardon territory.

Bose or HK are nothing impressive. If you want good sound, check out JL Audio or McIntosh.

I can't wait for JL Audio to come out with a stealth subwoofer enclosure for the Smart fortwo.

I currently have a McIntosh amp, but it's too large to install in a fortwo. I need to get a smaller version and see if it's possible to install under a seat and maybe get it to run in 3 channels so two channels can run the left and right speakers and the other can power the subwoofer. A McIntosh amp is as clean as power as you're going to get with a distortion rate down to an amazing .005% THD.

Factory radios and stuff typically have a very high distortion rate as of almost .1% to 10% THD which is why the radios always sound like crap when you turn them loud. They probably do this on purpose to keep people from playing their radios too loud.

Wazabi Owner · 06-12-2009, 08:14 PM

JUST TURNED OVER 28,000 miles today!

Knock on wood, no problems so far. My other Smart turned over 13,000 earlier this week too, luckily no problems with that as well. They have both been great cars. While I haven't been logging my miles here, but I have been logging them and have maintained an average of 42.9mpg. My other Smart with 13k I've only done 40.8mpg.

I've put a few paint jobs on these things as they are a cinch to paint, it's like getting a new car every few months.

Smart came out with a website for owners that have wrecked their Smarts to post their experiences. This was in rebuttal to the wonderful report done by the IIHS. It's safeandsmart.com.

So far, I still do not regret buying multiples of these things but I have a hankering to get my old diesel Jetta back on the road again. I have also added a Yaris to the stable but it was for my kid. She had a 99 Escort I bought new but it dropped a valve seat and she needed a car so I offered up one of the Smarts, after driving it one day she said no because too many people ask questions about it and she found that creepy and annoying. I told her I would chose what she would buy since the loan was under my name too. I got a 3dr Yaris w/auto. Nice car but I've driven it about 60 miles and it now has 6800 miles on it.

The latest paint job

thisisntjared · 06-13-2009, 08:09 PM

the teal looks tough! i like it with the black!

Wazabi Owner · 06-13-2009, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thisisntjared

the teal looks tough! i like it with the black!

Thanks.

And since I'm not such a lightweight twigboy - when the spousal unit and myself are in it quite a few people have mentioned they thought I lowered it. I honestly think its an illusion with everything being color coordinated and blacked out. What I mean by color coordinated is I painted about 75% of the stuff on the car that was black plastic from the factory.

Wazabi Owner · 10-08-2009, 07:02 PM

Latest and greatest

Green car has 35,000 miles - 42.4mpg

Teal car has 19,100 miles - 40.5mpg

In a few weeks I am giving the teal one to my kid, painting it pink too. I will be taking her 2009 Yaris in trade.

Mike T · 10-11-2009, 07:47 PM

82000 miles on mine and all is still well!

Wazabi Owner · 03-11-2010, 08:37 PM

Update:

43,300 miles over 23 months of ownership.

These miles have been mostly trouble-free. Mechanically the car has been great. I did have a problem with the polycarbonate roof and had it replaced under warranty. After 2 years I still love it and don't regret it! While I haven't maintained my mileage records here, I have recorded them and I have and I'm at 42.0 mpg over the 43k.

I gave up one of my smarts for a '09 Yaris 3dr. It was my daughter's Yaris and we swapped even as my wife didn't like that the smart doesn't have a tilt wheel. I painted it pink before I gave it to her.

2 years worth of modding a new car. The latest was a set of wider wheels. I fell for putting gigantic wheels on a car before and it killed my mileage. Not this time. They are a little bit wider than stock but not much. I took this up on The Tail of the Dragon last year and it handles like a go-kart so with the new wheels it is that much better. Also added was a better air intake hose and a K&N style air filter, nothing dramatic. On the inside I went with a Pioneer AVIC D-3 and also added an armrest.

Those mods are just the latest stuff, lot more has been done. It is such an incredibly simple car I just had to modify it. All that being said....I have 4k-5k of DIRT ROADS on this car!!

~~spotaneagle~~ · 03-12-2010, 05:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theholycow

In my experience, a couple stupid sensors die and the computer just deals with it, running fine on the data it gets from everywhere else. Then, plug in a scanner, and it takes you right to the sensor. Test the sensor, if it's bad replace it, if it's good then you get to fix a problem before it breaks other stuff (or ignore it).

I too like the simplicity of older cars, but really...even when they were new you couldn't buy them and only do oil changes for 100,000 miles, one tuneup, and then drive another 100,000 miles without a repair.

The only problem my 180,000 mile old 2002 model truck has had that wouldn't happen in an old-tech car is a fuel injection pressure leak. It runs fine and I'm getting 33% over EPA, but I have to turn the key to "On" and wait a couple seconds for the fuel pump to prime before I crank the starter.

Other problems, which would have happened regardless of technology: Wheel bearings (lots of them), an oil leak, and corroded tailgate cables.

the great thing about light cars is that all the suspension, brakes, usually last longer at least ive foudn that true with my saturn, i have had a few of em with original back breaks to 200k, if you dont beat on your breaks they last forever almost

Wazabi Owner · 03-12-2010, 06:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spotaneagle

the great thing about light cars is that all the suspension, brakes, usually last longer at least ive foudn that true with my saturn, i have had a few of em with original back breaks to 200k, if you dont beat on your breaks they last forever almost

Good point. In the picture above the drums aren't painted, I took that 2 weeks ago when I installed the rims. Last weekend I pulled the calipers and drums off to paint them and inspected all the associated parts. Pads and shoes are still like brand new. The smart is a little heavier than one would expect weighing in at 1840lbs. Next week I may throw it on the scales to see if it has gained any weight.

Wazabi Owner · 10-05-2010, 10:01 AM

30 months of ownership - 54,000 trouble free miles at 40.4mpg!

Mileage went down because I added heavier wheels with non-LRR tires and a wider footprint. On top of that I stopped hypermiling. Driving it ver aggressively now mostly because all my trips are shorter compared to the 40-50 trips I always went on before.

Almost 3 years of ownership I still LOVE this car! After owning over 100 cars this is the longest I have ever kept a daily driver and still stayed satisfied with it. That says A LOT!