Plasma Spark Ignition breakthrough

[vectorhho]

Hi there

Came across this the other day.

I have been following this online research for a while at:
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...rkplug-85.html

This technology is being worked upon by multiple researchers online and the working device in the video seems to be extremely efficient for the size of the plasma ignition kernel. Largest ignition kernel I have ever seen. And this technology is emerging and developing so fast...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GuNvuPMGu6c
Would definitely like to see the mPG gain and torque increase with that thing on a V8...

any thoughts?

[kamesama980]

yay for bots/spam/ads

[dkjones96]

This is interesting spam tho. I'm curious as to how it works!

[theclencher]

It works just like magnets, HHO, fish carbs...

[dkjones96]

fish carbs? lol

Be nice to the auxiliary gap box.

[zero_gravity]

if this thing doesn't crack the carbon chains, act as a catalyst, and clean my windshield i'm not interested

[theholycow]

Fish carbohydrates, eh?

[TomO]

ALBATROSS! Get your Albatross here!


I wonder if tethering several albatross to my VX would help too?

[dkjones96]

Here are your fish carbohydrates.

[GasUser]

.....will it make me a sandwich too.....

[vectorhho]

Originally Posted by kamesama980

yay for bots/spam/ads

Hello

This is not spam folks...its real just google plasma spark or plasma spark ignition and you will see a ton of links to similar devices. I cant believe none of you guys are taking this seriously....here are the latest dyno tests with plasma spark ignition


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Cd2Oug1wk0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DejP0q_Ygfo

There are a whole bunch of plasma spark videos on youtube...but the ones i posted on the forum seem to be the only working ready installable prototype.

http://www.youtube.com/results?searc...a+spark&aq= f

http://www.thetruckersreport.com/tru...n-systems.html

[theholycow]

Pardon our skepticism. We get a lot of very similar posts that invariably end up being spam for illegitimate businesses. As such, we feel like if it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, smells like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it's probably at least something vaguely avian.

[dkjones96]

I don't know about others on the forum here but when I see something like this I want to know HOW it works.

Is it a coil that just injects a gross amount of current through a non-resistor plug? (because you should already know that the resistor itself will keep a spark from going bright like that without excessive voltage) Is it an auxiliary gap system running through a normal resistor plug?

They had me going until this page.

Also, their plasma spark gallery is photo shopped.

[shatto]

I got all excited about it.......until I realized I would need eight of them.

I tested Pulstars until one failed. They do work and provide smoother running and a bit more snap accelerating.

However, no change in MPG at all.
I suspect the feedback system that sets the mixture interpreted the cleaner exhaust as running lean and simply added gas.

[vectorhho]

Originally Posted by dkjones96

I don't know about others on the forum here but when I see something like this I want to know HOW it works.

Is it a coil that just injects a gross amount of current through a non-resistor plug? (because you should already know that the resistor itself will keep a spark from going bright like that without excessive voltage) Is it an auxiliary gap system running through a normal resistor plug?

They had me going until this page.

Also, their plasma spark gallery is photo shopped.

They clearly say non resistor plug on the video...

Guys this plasma ignition stuff is totally new and a whole bunch of people online are working on it.
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...sparkplug.html


The spark effect is real judging by the size of the plasma spark on their videos....but if you dont believe me here are other replications of the effect by others...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjBkqNc0GrQ
watch this video (link above) from 1:30 onwards

Here is another:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iGcqD...e=channel_page


Watch this users videos...
http://www.youtube.com/user/jstadwater007


I dont think all these videos are faked or photoshopped

Just type plasma spark or plasma spark ignition on youtube...there a bunch of similar setups with really bright large plasma balls.

this kind of ignition system was previously available for JEt engines....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NmHW65093_o

What is impressive about the Aquapulser.com site is they seem to have got a working model for cars.


And finally with regards to you not taking this seriously because of their research page....

watch this BBC equinox documentary series:

http://www.documentary-film.net/sear...e.php?&ref=195

[vectorhho]

Originally Posted by shatto

I got all excited about it.......until I realized I would need eight of them.

In this dyno test video they show only unit one installed for a 6 cylinder and a 4 cylinder.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Cd2Oug1wk0


Also check out the hookup video for a V8 distributor again only one unit per vehicle:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DejP0q_Ygfo


Finally its on the description in their videos that you only need one per vehicle.


Heres another plasma unit installed on a vehicle
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-pGMOZn42CU

but its not aquapulser...again only one unit per vehicle.

[theclencher]

anyone that has "hho" in their name pretty much has no legitimacy right from the get-go.

[Geonerd]

OK, let's assume the magic plasma makes a bigger spark.

This will likely accelerate the flame propagation (otherwise, what's the point??), effectively advancing the ignition timing. Great, now the engine is pinging.

The ECU will promptly retard the ignition lead angle, leaving you right back where you started. (Well, your wallet will be lighter. This should improve mileage a hair!)

The only way these things will help is if your engine has an erratic, inconsistent spark. But in that case, you'd be better off with new plugs, wires, etc....

[dkjones96]

Wrong.

If you create a bigger spark and you get a better burn(effectively advancing timing) and then you retard the timing you aren't left where you were before.

If it takes 45 degrees of crank rotation from the time you spark the plug to the time you hit peak cylinder pressure and with a plasma spark ignition setup you only take 40 degrees you've just taken away 5 degrees of crank rotation from every cylinder on every cycle where the burning of the air and fuel is trying to turn the engine backwards. You're getting rid of a little bit of waste.

[shatto]

Which goes back to my observation, previously made, that the performance improves a bit but there is no change in gas mileage.
To get full benefit of the more complete combustion, we will need to re-program the computer. Don't you think?

[vectorhho]

Originally Posted by theclencher

anyone that has "hho" in their name pretty much has no legitimacy right from the get-go.

Why dont you look up at the top right hand corner of this page you are now reading. You will see an ad "use Water for Fuel to Double Gas Mileage"..click on it and it takes you to

http://riskassets.water4gas.hop.clickbank.net/

If there ever was a scamo fuel saver ad this would take the cake....

I guess by your logic this forum also has no legitimacy. you should quit this forum as the forum owners / moderators have no problem taking money for posting ads that claim to use water as fuel to double gas mileage...


but my posts on an ignition device has no legitimacy because my id has hho in it....yeah right

[dkjones96]

Well, complete combustion does a couple of things but I don't think it's more than any typical EFI controller can't compensate for(and not for the worse).

As mentioned above, one benefit of the hotter spark is less time between the spark event and peak cylinder pressure. The ECU will just compensate for this in the spark table and continue advancing to the edge of knock as usual.

Another benefit is less oxygen in the exhaust. This reduction will make the ecu read rich and lean the mixture out a little to keep the amount of oxygen in the exhaust at a level that makes the cat happy.

I can totally see the economy benefits of it, but if one plasma technology doesn't work for increasing mileage in your car there is no reason to think that another is different.

I do worry about using non-resistor plugs in a computer controlled vehicle. It might not cause stalling or crazy issues but it can corrupt fuel trim writes and such.

[Geonerd]

Originally Posted by dkjones96

Wrong.

If you create a bigger spark and you get a better burn(effectively advancing timing) and then you retard the timing you aren't left where you were before.

If it takes 45 degrees of crank rotation from the time you spark the plug to the time you hit peak cylinder pressure and with a plasma spark ignition setup you only take 40 degrees you've just taken away 5 degrees of crank rotation from every cylinder on every cycle where the burning of the air and fuel is trying to turn the engine backwards. You're getting rid of a little bit of waste.

I don't buy your logic.

If the Magic Plugs could somehow light off a sizable fraction of the cylinder area, you might manage to shorten the combustion cycle enough to realize some efficiency savings. I don't see that happening. 'Plasma' or no, you're still starting the ignition with a relatively small spark.

I'm willing to bet that a plasma ignited flame kernel is not significantly different than a fractionally older kernel set off by a plain Jane spark plug. Moving forward from the time that both kernels are of equal size, their behavior and burn characteristics will be indistinguishable.

[markweatherill]

I'd like a more believable way of getting the plasma into the engine. Perhaps someone could bottle it. Can it be harvested from junked plasma TVs?

[theclencher]

All that donated blood has a shelf life. Maybe we could get that plasma and throw it in the tank.

[theholycow]

I think we should use warp plasma.