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09-05-2005, 01:08 PM
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#1
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*shrug*
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 7,406
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Modification: Warm Air Intake
<p>Yup, you heard right: <em>warm</em> air intake. So basically, the idea behind this is to reroute your air intake to suck air from somewhere hot, and that hotairness will get picked up by the temperature sensor on the intake and the Engine Control Unit (ecu) will lean out the car's air fuel mixture, meaning you use less gas! Sounds pretty cool, huh? </p><p>The actual modification is pretty simple:</p><p>Take some hoses and duct tape and attach something to the end of the intake and run it down near the catalytic converter where it'll suck some really hot air.</p><p> This would make a great experiment I should think, and it'll be good to do it, but first it would be good to standardize to a degree the materials, tubing size, and placement first, as well as getting it done properly with some pictures posted to do a good DIY on it. </p><p>Whaddya think?<br /><br />
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09-05-2005, 01:34 PM
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#2
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*shrug*
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 7,406
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Read and un-read topics
<p><img vspace="0" hspace="0" border="0" align="bottom" src="http://www.greenhybrid.com/share/files/1/5/0/HoseInfo.JPG" />
This first picture is of the hoses you need to go buy at your autoparts store. Should be under 10 bucks each, 30 inches per hose.
</p><p><img vspace="0" hspace="0" border="0" align="bottom" src="http://www.greenhybrid.com/share/files/1/5/0/HosesConnedted.JPG" />
Tape the hoses together like so to make one big ole hose.
</p><p><img vspace="0" hspace="0" border="0" align="bottom" src="http://www.greenhybrid.com/share/files/1/5/0/InstallationComplete1.JPG" />
Attach one end of the hose to your airbox and snake it around so that the other end of the hose can get down to your catalytic converter.
</p><p><img vspace="0" hspace="0" border="0" align="bottom" src="http://www.greenhybrid.com/share/files/1/5/0/Routing3.JPG" />
Here's a picture of the end of the hose sucking air from near the catalytic converter!
Pretty simple and quick and quick, if I do say so myself.
</p> |
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09-05-2005, 01:43 PM
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#3
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FE nut
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Elkhart, IN
Posts: 1,193
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I have even heard of
I have even heard of plumbing a small heater core to fit in the air box.
__________________
Horsepower is how hard you hit the wall, torque is how much of the wall you take with you.
2007 Prius,
  
Team Slow Burn
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09-05-2005, 01:44 PM
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#4
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*shrug*
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 7,406
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maxc
I've never heard of that but later on I will post about creating an air damn behind the radiator to keep the engine compartment warmer. ^_^
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09-05-2005, 04:08 PM
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#5
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Driving on E
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Salt Lake City, UT
Posts: 3,993
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two weeks later - how is the software?
On one forum I saw a guy who made a WAI/CAI combo. It had a small sensor that read the temperature of the air. When the air reached a certain amount, it would switch between the warm air and cold air. My understanding is that the marginal benefits of WAI decline after the temperature outside is a certain level. This contraption that switches between Warm air and cold air depending on the temperature of the air is a cool idea of you ask me.
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09-05-2005, 04:12 PM
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#6
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*shrug*
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 7,406
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Alberta Environment Driving SUVs?
I imagine it has something to do with a something something. What are the called. Some sort of valve you stick on your CAI is you don't want to get hydrolocked. I dunno, something electrical, I can;t think how to fab up something like that offhand.
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10-01-2005, 05:09 PM
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#7
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*shrug*
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 7,406
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Hmm
Anyone want to try it out?
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10-01-2005, 05:54 PM
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#8
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granny just passed me
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 1,200
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no, I could put the air
no, I could put the air temp sensor over my radiator hose. That way my car thinks its +100F. And it leans out the fuel a bit.
Well, that is what i hear.
__________________
2008 EPA adjusted:
Distance traveled by bicycle in 2007= 1,830ish miles
Average commute speed=25mph (yes, that's in a car)
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10-01-2005, 06:02 PM
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#9
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*shrug*
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 7,406
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Haha
You could do that also, but I figure it would be less bad to not move the sensor all over, but what do I know.
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10-01-2005, 06:22 PM
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#10
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FE nut
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Elkhart, IN
Posts: 1,193
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On my Saturn, I just unplug
On my Saturn, I just unplug the air temp sensor and stick some resistors in the end of the plug. On this car it is around 110 ohms or so. This way I can easily return everything to stock when necessary.
__________________
Horsepower is how hard you hit the wall, torque is how much of the wall you take with you.
2007 Prius,
Team Slow Burn
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10-01-2005, 06:54 PM
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#11
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*shrug*
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 7,406
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Re: On my Saturn, I just unplug
Quote:
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Originally Posted by diamondlarry
On my Saturn, I just unplug the air temp sensor and stick some resistors in the end of the plug. On this car it is around 110 ohms or so. This way I can easily return everything to stock when necessary.
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I'm not really an electrical wiz, so do you think your could explain a bit of the theory behind this? |
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10-01-2005, 07:25 PM
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#12
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Junior Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 69
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just makes it think it is
just makes it think it is one temp when its not.
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10-01-2005, 07:37 PM
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#13
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*shrug*
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 7,406
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Hmm
So then would 110 ohms work for all cars or is it something I need to figure out differently for my honda? That makes sense, I just wonder what temperature I should try to trick it into thinking it is.
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10-01-2005, 07:45 PM
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#14
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Junior Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 69
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i dont think his resistors
no clue
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10-01-2005, 08:27 PM
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#15
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Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Texas Hill Country
Posts: 153
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Well the temperature is
Well the temperature is calculated by measuring the voltage drop across the sensor. The voltage drop changes with resistance of the sensor, and the sensor's resistence changes with temperature. It's a temperature controlled variable resistor of sorts.
You could use a potentiometer in place of a resistor (also a variable resistor, but controlled by a knob) so you could test a range of resistences easily.
__________________
Scouring the country for an excellent condition Civic VX
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10-01-2005, 08:32 PM
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#16
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*shrug*
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 7,406
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Aha
That makes sense, I learned this last year. So then do you think there is anyway to ballpark what is too much or too little resistance or should I just get a knob and then try it out? Seems like something for your afr tweaker/instantaneous mpg gauge also.
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10-01-2005, 09:01 PM
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#17
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FE nut
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Elkhart, IN
Posts: 1,193
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I was looking in my Hayne's
I was looking in my Hayne's manual for my Saturn about how to test the air temperature sensor for proper operation. That's how I found out that the sensor's resistance varied with temperature. I had a variable resistor laying around so I hooked it into the plug that went onto the sensor. I found that the potentiometer was very difficult to control but I did notice that, according to my Scaguage, when I varied the resistance to the equivalent of anything over about 250 degrees or so that the "check engine" light came on. I went to Radio Shack and bought some 1/4 watt resistors and started putting them together until the light came on. The combination I came up with was 1-100 ohm resistor in series with 2-22 ohm resistors in parallel. This is actually 111 ohms. It's hard to say whether this would be the same for all cars but it's worth checking out.
__________________
Horsepower is how hard you hit the wall, torque is how much of the wall you take with you.
2007 Prius,
Team Slow Burn
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10-01-2005, 09:11 PM
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#18
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*shrug*
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 7,406
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Okay thanks
Well that solves a lot of my questions about intake stuff, haha, I'll have to try it out one of these days, mehbe since I've only got 92 hp I could wire the knob inside and then just heat it up a lot when I'm cruising and not when I am accelerating. Unless it makes no difference really. How much mpg difference was there on the scan gauge?
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10-01-2005, 11:07 PM
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#19
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FE nut
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Elkhart, IN
Posts: 1,193
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I will have to get back to
I will have to get back to you on the mpg difference. I made the change back in April and forgot what the mileage was before the change. I'll do some runs with and without the mod to get the mileage difference. I'll do some runs on my favorite test route. It's a 10 mile trip on a county road(5 miles out and 5 back) with not too much traffic. I'll do 2 with the mod then 2 more at stock.
__________________
Horsepower is how hard you hit the wall, torque is how much of the wall you take with you.
2007 Prius,
Team Slow Burn
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10-01-2005, 11:16 PM
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#20
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*shrug*
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 7,406
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Cool
That sounds great, I'm interested to hear the results. By your method you'd have it running just under 250 degrees, right?
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10-01-2005, 11:54 PM
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#21
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FE nut
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Elkhart, IN
Posts: 1,193
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Yeah. Even though they are
Yeah. Even though they are fixed value resistors, the temp varies slightly. It seems to vary between 242 and 247.
__________________
Horsepower is how hard you hit the wall, torque is how much of the wall you take with you.
2007 Prius,
Team Slow Burn
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10-02-2005, 11:45 AM
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#22
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Junior Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 69
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cool, get that testing done
cool, get that testing done :-)
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10-02-2005, 07:31 PM
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#23
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*shrug*
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 7,406
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Question
I know that the actual improvement numbers will have to wait for you to test, but I'm wondering. I think it was flatland I was talking about this with the other night, and he mentioned about the 02 sensor, and I was wondering how much the 02 sensor will realize the temperature is wrong and the burn is too lean and richen it up? It might be different since you're obd2 and I'm obd0, but I figure if it yours will still leave it lean than mine would be more likely to leave it even leaner.
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10-02-2005, 07:56 PM
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#24
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FE nut
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Elkhart, IN
Posts: 1,193
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With my EFIE device fooling
With my EFIE device fooling the computer into thinking the mixture is rich I'm able to overcome most of those problems. Without the EFIE the ECU would likely counteract anything I would try.
__________________
Horsepower is how hard you hit the wall, torque is how much of the wall you take with you.
2007 Prius,
Team Slow Burn
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10-02-2005, 07:59 PM
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#25
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*shrug*
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 7,406
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Aha!
Good point, I forgot about that. I want to go looking for one now...Are you feeling a huge power drop because of the intake thing or something like that?
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10-02-2005, 08:15 PM
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#26
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FE nut
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Elkhart, IN
Posts: 1,193
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There doesn't seem to be a
There doesn't seem to be a huge power drop. I know this because if I'm not carefull when turning onto a crowded highway, I end up lighting up the tires. Not so much with the new tires though. By the way, in case anyone was wondering about my picture, it's what my piggybank looks like when I go to the gas station.
__________________
Horsepower is how hard you hit the wall, torque is how much of the wall you take with you.
2007 Prius,
Team Slow Burn
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10-03-2005, 05:25 PM
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#27
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FE nut
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Elkhart, IN
Posts: 1,193
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Here are the numbers from my
Here are the numbers from my testing. I did two runs of 10 miles each with the mod and without. Since I had the mod in place I srarted with that first. Here are the numbers: with(mod)-56.5 & 57.1, without(stock)- 44.2 & 44.6. If I've done my math correctly, this figures out to be a little over 28% increase. A bit shocking for something so simple. It will be interesting to see what happens when the temps fall to around zero in the Indiana winter.
__________________
Horsepower is how hard you hit the wall, torque is how much of the wall you take with you.
2007 Prius,
Team Slow Burn
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10-03-2005, 05:31 PM
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#28
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Driving on E
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Salt Lake City, UT
Posts: 3,993
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Diamondlarry,
Is the mod
Diamondlarry,
Is the mod you're talking about the warm air intake, or the little plug you put on your Intake Air Temp sensor to trick it?
Also, I'm curious to know if this type of modification has any long term negative effect on the engine (running too lean, etc.)
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10-03-2005, 06:05 PM
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#29
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FE nut
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Elkhart, IN
Posts: 1,193
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Actually I just twisted the
Actually I just twisted the resistor combination together and shoved the ends into the plug. As far as any damage goes, I have been running this way since back in April and haven't noticed any adverse effects.
__________________
Horsepower is how hard you hit the wall, torque is how much of the wall you take with you.
2007 Prius,
Team Slow Burn
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10-03-2005, 06:13 PM
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#30
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*shrug*
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 7,406
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Re: Actually I just twisted the
Quote:
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Originally Posted by diamondlarry
Actually I just twisted the resistor combination together and shoved the ends into the plug. As far as any damage goes, I have been running this way since back in April and haven't noticed any adverse effects.
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Could you see a difference on the temperature gauge for the engine or anything to suggest it was running hot? That's a mondo increase. Think you could test with the mod but minus the EFIE also? I'd be interested to see hwo much correction there is. |
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