New Dodge sub-compact from China.

[Fuzzy5150]

I would be interested to get input about the Chery A1 that will hit our shores in early 08 under the Dodge banner.

[88HF]

http://www.chinacartimes.com/2007/03...t-economy-car/



http://www.chinacartimes.com/2007/01...ce-in-beijing/



Chevrolet Spark, Suzuki Swift:

http://sushubh.net/archives/2006/03/28/chevrolet-spark/

[Red]

Looks kinda like a Fit, wonder what its going to retail for.

[88HF]

I wish they'd make the crx hf again. It'd be so nice to have one new.

[88HF]

about $10,000 I think. They said $7,100 equiv. in China. They'll charge us more of course.

[Rick Rae]

Tuff-lookin' little car, at least from those angles. I don't think I'd be ashamed to drive one. Hafta lose the roof rails for aero efficiency, though.

Originally Posted by Red

Looks kinda like a Fit...

That's one I'm considering for a business vehicle (I need decent and flexible cargo space). Given the EPA ratings it shouldn't take much to get it over 50MPG, though I don't know how well it'll hypermile beyond that. (Opinions and experiences welcomed.)

Rick

[brucepick]

Looks like on the economy version, they already did a pretty decent upper grill block.
Lots of big openings in the lower area though.

A case of great minds thinking alike, I'm certain.

[baddog671]

Absolute junk, I wouldn't own one if it was given to me.. The Chinese cant build anything quality, what makes a car any different...

I predict they get to about 100k if your lucky and blow up..

[88HF]

Thats kind of an ******* thing to say. People used to feel the same way about the Japanese, then the Koreans. I think the Chinese are doing well, I wouldn't put them down like that.

[omgwtfbyobbq]

The Chinese have a lot of our manufacturing equipment. Besides Central and South American, that's where most of our industry labor was outsourced to.

[McPatrick]

I'd be weary with those Chery's for now. In Belgium someone started importing Chery's this year. Then the German AAA did crash tests with them and they got one measly star out of 5. Needless to say the importer in Belgium stopped importing them.
I'm sure they are cheap, but what is cheap if you could buy a perfectly fine used car for a few grand?

[Spule 4]

I guess you all missed the attempt to sell some Chinese cars in Europe, they had a bit of a problem failing their TUeV crash tests:

http://www.autoblog.com/2007/06/22/b...-anything-but/

The tide is about to change for the US interest in goods from China.....just watch the news.

[roadrunner]

China will someday be the largest car manufacturer in the world, it is just a matter of when. That is why so many auto companies are getting into China.
I heard that on NPR this week, and I believe it will happen.

[lovemysan]

Originally Posted by Spule 4

I guess you all missed the attempt to sell some Chinese cars in Europe, they had a bit of a problem failing their TUeV crash tests:

http://www.autoblog.com/2007/06/22/b...-anything-but/

The tide is about to change for the US interest in goods from China.....just watch the news.

That car was definitely made of boogers and wafers. They make bad ice cream too.

[Fuzzy5150]

Wow! What a wide range of comments....everything from phobic drivel to some very open and informed comments.

Thanks all......
Semper Fi

[omgwtfbyobbq]

Hmmm... While the QQ may not be the safest thing in the world, considering it's sold brand spankin' new for ~$4-5000 in China, but is slated for $10000 here makes me think it'll go through plenty of upgrades for the US market. It don't take no five grand to ship a car across the Pacific.

[cfg83]

88HF -

Originally Posted by 88HF

Thats kind of an ******* thing to say. People used to feel the same way about the Japanese, then the Koreans. I think the Chinese are doing well, I wouldn't put them down like that.

But are they following the "Japanese Arc" of success? Wasn't Korea already a well established industrial nation when Hyundai came to the United States? The Chinese have volume and cheap labor down pat, but they're doing it at a massive cost in pollution to themselves. How many Japanese food recalls do you remember seeing over the years?

Environment of China
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Environment_of_China
beijing_pollution.jpg

The Xinhua News Agency has quoted an environmental official, Wang Jinnan, as saying that more than 410,000 Chinese die as a result of pollution each year.[2] The Financial Times said a World Bank report, entitled Cost of Pollution in China, found up to 760,000 people die prematurely each year in China because of air and water pollution. High levels of air pollution in China's cities leads to 350,000-400,000 premature deaths, it said. Another 300,000 die because of poor-quality air indoors. The newspaper article, quoting World Bank advisers and Chinese officials, also said research showing that there are 60,000 premature deaths each year because of poor-quality water.

CarloSW2

[Mentalic]

China has its issues, they will do almost anything to save a nickel even when they know its hurting others. So much in the news about food ingredient substitutions ya have to wonder...
Just this week:

http://metropost.com/let-them-eat-ca...per/2007/07/12

http://mwcnews.net/content/view/15391&Itemid=1

[MnFocus]

Originally Posted by Spule 4

The tide is about to change for the US interest in goods from China.....just watch the news.

Hey Clencher ?! Do you have any sorta local news about one Amy Klobuchar regarding safety of Chinese made goods ? I heard a snippet about something on the radio ( I have no TV and I will not pay for newspapers ) .
This is all I came up with regarding more toys and everday consumer goods . I'm sure the autos aren't much different though.

[MnFocus]

Originally Posted by cfg83

The Chinese have volume and cheap labor down pat, but they're doing it at a massive cost in pollution to themselves.
CarloSW2

Their auto market shows 24 cars to 1000 drivers - expected to rise rapidly . Can they mobilize to fill their *own* potential demand with any quality , much less fill the worlds demand with a decent quality product?
While they have potential for volume production and plenty of cheap labor ...the components to assemble said products are not cheap . Obviously they can make them - but given the history of their production start ups -With What Quality? It took the Japanese auto makers nearly 20 years to recover from the 'cheap car stigma' - something China canNot afford to do . They'll bump quality before attempting a serious export business. (diregarding a few feable attempts by brave souls with money to burn and no ties between ears and brain ...like the Big 3 automakers!?? )

[Spule 4]

There are two things going against China, and both are their own doing.....

Well, maybe three.

The first is they have driven up the costs of raw materials for about anything right now. Try and buy copper in any large (heck, small) amount and you will see what I mean. Anyone remember why a LARGE amount of scrap steel went away about two years ago (older junkyards cleared out, "yard art" cars were leaving their grassy environs, etc.) yup, China. This will rase the advantage that China did have with "State" pricing of these materials below global market cost, now they have to outsource it from other locations, so the pricing break went away.

Two, the standards of living have improved, so guess what, their wages are following suit. So the advantages of moving or making anything in China are slipping. One of the large financial papers/magaizines just ran an article on the real costs of sending anything to China. While the labor and SHORT TERM savings are great, the total long term return is only a 10% reduction in domestic costs.

Three, there is a bit of corruption in their Commucapitalist government, as was seen this week when the "head" of their Safety and Health found himself dead. Bad drugs and baby food that killed a few thousand in China was not news here, even tho it should be, heck, the village of Wenlu's AIDS epidemic (caused by the State) and a tanted countrywide bloodbank barely makes news here, and generally only in the GLBT press.

Stateside, killing Fido and Fluffy and putting lead based paint on your Thomas toys, now that is. This hits the American consumer, like any safety issue. These two things (pets and kids) are where America puts its interest, why every home Safety and Health product advert (from a security system, to a water filter, to carpet cleaners) show little kids or pets. Why the tire thing got little press.

It will also be interesting to see how well the '08 Olympics go, there are already global concerns over this, but not to worry, the government is already cracking down on foreign and domestic Christian groups inside China to prevent any unrest.

But hey, it may improve, it is now illegal to put Glycol in toothpaste there, so that is a start!

Sorry to bash the Chinese so much, oh wait, there is a black Dong Feng sedan with WalMart stickers on it in the driveway....knock at the door....sorry guys, no more posts to me, I am off to build highways near Mongolia with the Tiananmen Square folks...

[Snax]

Our family avoids purchasing any products produced in countries like China where products are being exported at market beating prices through the exploitation of workers. It is nothing against China in general, only their labor practices.

Likewise, we have comparatively little concern about imports from Europe or Japan of products that are more desireable than what is produced domestically. So long as the trade practices are fair (not necessarily 'free market'), to the victor goes the spoils so to speak.

[TANGOJETTA]

Here is Chery crash test video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5kQGAK550LE

[Snax]

GM doesn't know how to make a responsible decision on anything.

[Bill in Houston]

Originally Posted by TANGOJETTA

Here is Chery crash test video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5kQGAK550LE

OOOoooooooo. Wow.

[Telco]

The rants may be that, but they are accurate. Dismissing them because they don't align with a particular viewpoint, and calling opposing viewpoints "phobic drivel" and aligned viewpoints "informed" is short sighted and narrow minded, and shows in itself a lack of information. It's called Chinese junk because the stuff is junk, and made in China. The Chinese have long had a culture of doing what they need to, with no regard to the consequences.

The video of the crash testing shows that their vehicles are unsafe beyond any possibility of calling the testing slanted. That car was tested with standardized tests, and failed horribly. No way I'd want a car that sits the engine in the BACK seat in a 40MPH crash. This video shows a Chinese 4x4 pushing the front passengers up like an accordian. Sure, the airbags deploy, but the dash, firewall and engine is also deployed into the passenger compartment. The only thing the airbag would do is ensure death in that accident. Then there's this 4-door sedan test that pushes the dash into the driver's head while buckling the roof and almost popping the driver's door off. Junk, junk and more junk. On the other hand, the [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ju6t-yyoU8s&mode=related&search=]Smart Car] can hit a concrete wall at 70MPH, and the passenger compartment stays intact. You can even open the doors. So, Chinese cars are built to kill you in otherwise survivable accidents, while other nation's vehicles are built to survive a harder wreck than the people inside can handle, meaning that it won't be a failure on the car's part if you die in a wreck.

[cfg83]

Spule 4 -

Originally Posted by Spule 4

...

Stateside, killing Fido and Fluffy and putting lead based paint on your Thomas toys, now that is. This hits the American consumer, like any safety issue. These two things (pets and kids) are where America puts its interest, why every home Safety and Health product advert (from a security system, to a water filter, to carpet cleaners) show little kids or pets. Why the tire thing got little press.

...

That's what happened to my kitty. I was giving my old kitty Science Diet wet food, so I thought I was immune. Then one day, I go to Petco and I find that her favorite Science Diet food had been pulled from the shelves. The vet said she was a goner. I was calling the Euthenasia folks when she started eating again. Thank goodness Purina Pro Plan hadn't sourced from that Chinese vendor!!!!!!!

I researched the tire thing and it didn't seem to effect "consumer" brand tires. It seemed to only be off-brand tires that were used in construction and trucking.

CarloSW2

[88HF]

I don't know why everyone here is saying its the Chinese fault... that they have no regard. They are simply misled by their government and allowed no hope for a better future... or at least their hope is what they are brainwashed into thinking. Not that the US doesn't have its own brainwashing. My point is, the Chinese are not born horrible people. There are just too many of them, extremely low standards of living. These things will improve for some as their middle-class rises, but they have a corrupt communist government. What can you expect? Even talking about this on gassavers promises that it will be censored on the Chinese internet. Greed and corruption is the same thing thats wrong with our country.

[omgwtfbyobbq]

Originally Posted by Telco

The rants may be that, but they are accurate. Dismissing them because they don't align with a particular viewpoint, and calling opposing viewpoints "phobic drivel" and aligned viewpoints "informed" is short sighted and narrow minded, and shows in itself a lack of information. It's called Chinese junk because the stuff is junk, and made in China. The Chinese have long had a culture of doing what they need to, with no regard to the consequences.

No posts here have been accurate in any way, shape, or form. All the statements made here regarding Chinese manufactured goods are qualitative, not quantitative. Which is besides the point, since they are still generalizations, and compare cars that are literally $3-6000 to cars that are $10-20000. If you pay more you're more likely to get more. Hell, these probably do better than plenty of 80s automobiles that currently fetch the same price used, but I don't see anyone ranting about those...

[Fuzzy5150]

Originally Posted by baddog671

Absolute junk, I wouldn't own one if it was given to me.. The Chinese cant build anything quality, what makes a car any different...

I predict they get to about 100k if your lucky and blow up..

This is my definition of 'drivel'...a phobic and uninformed dismissial simply because it doesn't align with this person's particular political/economic reality. I started this thread to get feed back....I expected the normal smattering of garden variety ignorance along with those who wish to engage in some type of intelligent conversation.

I don't have an agenda, other than trying to seek an affordable vehicle that can also get more than 40 mpg.

Obviously, you two offer only the same thing......so noted.

"The rants may be that, but they are accurate. Dismissing them because they don't align with a particular viewpoint, and calling opposing viewpoints "phobic drivel" and aligned viewpoints "informed" is short sighted and narrow minded, and shows in itself a lack of information. It's called Chinese junk because the stuff is junk, and made in China. The Chinese have long had a culture of doing what they need to, with no regard to the consequences."