$4 a gallon and back to their old ways - already!

[jadziasman]

Well, the slowdown on the highways I drive every day didn't last long.

Most cars passing me are driving faster than the posted 70 mph limit from what I can judge as they whiz by me while I try to stay at 60 mph. Apparently the few minutes they save going faster is worth it to them.

I have no clue now what it's going to take to get them to slow down. Will it be a $100 fill up? More?

[adamsjd1]

People think speed is the most important thing. Why do you think even in this day of "saving on fuel" that all the newest cars coming out in the next 2-3 years tout "MORE HORSEPOWER!! MORE ROOM!! BIGGER THAN EVER!!!" It's all a false image to me.

I don't care how fast it goes. As long as my family fits into it, and I get where I need to go. I'll build my own fast car when I have the time and money.

[fumesucker]

Depending on the car, we are already at or past a $100 fill up..

If you've ever tried to talk cars to most people, you will have found out that very few people understand cars as well as most of the posters on a board like this one.

Intellectually, quite a few people know that slowing down saves gas, but emotionally speaking, almost no one gets it.

Man is not a rational animal, man is an animal that rationalizes.

And we will rationalize that which we want to do until it is more than abundantly clear that what we want to do is self destructive.

People will not slow down until they see something like a Scangauge right in front of them and it's calibrated in dollars.. When they see the stoplight to stoplight top fuel race just cost them a cool buck, maybe then they will slow down.

Old habits die hard and the fuel wasting habit is going to die a long and extended death.

[waddie]

So I typically have a very heavy foot, partly because I grew up in the country and had a 20 minute drive to civilization. I used to brag that I never or RARELY get passed. Well my driving habits have changed; yesterday, for the first time ever, I didn't pass anyone. I got stuck behind a slow semi going 5 or 10 under and it was perfect! I maybe added a minute or two to my typical 18 minute commute but I'm a recovering speed-a-holic and it was a milestone for me. I’ve been trying to hypermile, not using brakes and super slow starts, for a while but I still worry about the people behind me and my time to get there. In a week I’m taking a road trip 200 miles one way and I’m going to drive 5 to 10 under, hypermile, and mask off some stuff just to see how it does. I typically get 29-31 with my wife’s Corolla drive 80ish I’m going to shoot for a minimum of 35. We'll see. It's a challenge for me to kick the speed habit, but if I can believe me ANYONE can.

[theholycow]

Originally Posted by theclencher

Bottom line is, people are stupid.

Ah, I love the closed minds. Sure, most people ARE stupid, but OTOH, some might get paid more per hour than driving slower saves, and some might be able to save a significant amount of time that they'd rather spend with their family (and are willing to purchase that time).

Originally Posted by adamsjd1

People think speed is the most important thing. Why do you think even in this day of "saving on fuel" that all the newest cars coming out in the next 2-3 years tout "MORE HORSEPOWER!! MORE ROOM!! BIGGER THAN EVER!!!" It's all a false image to me.

What does room and size have to do with speed?

Originally Posted by waddie

It's a challenge for me to kick the speed habit, but if I can believe me ANYONE can.

The hard part is staying off the stuff.

[JanGeo]

Well if we are going to have to pay outrageous amounts of money for gasoline at least I dont' have to also loose time driving slowly to where I want to go! . . . is probably what they are thinking!

[ihatemybike]

Current and average fuel economy gauges should become mandatory on all new vehicles. I drive Green with the current mpg showing on the info center and it's a lot easier to work on my driving technique in that van, when compared to Grumpy which does not have the info center. Every time I drive Grumpy I instinctively find myself looking to where the info center is on Green wanting to check my current mpg. Can't wait to get my first ScanGaugeII and see what Grumpy can do.

Oh, living in Chicagoland where the highest national gas prices are and having two vans with 27 gallon tanks. That $100 mark is getting very close. I'm actually thinking about fabricating a 10 gallon tank to put in Green for local driving. It will reduce my range to about 200 miles, but I'll be dropping over 100 pounds.

[tjts1]

Bottom line is, people have a life.

[theholycow]

Originally Posted by ihatemybike

Current and average fuel economy gauges should become mandatory on all new vehicles.

I'm usually not a fan of legislating things like that, but I can get behind that idea. It would cost no more than the TPMS that's now required. It would be the most cost-effective, and probably just plain the most effective, FE mod that can be done.

I'm actually thinking about fabricating a 10 gallon tank to put in Green for local driving. It will reduce my range to about 200 miles, but I'll be dropping over 100 pounds.

Why fabricate one yourself? You could use a professionally designed, professionally fabricated tank, which ought to be cheap from a junkyard, or you can use a really nice racing tank that can probably easily be bought from Jegs/Summit.

Or, you know, you could just not fill it up when you get gas.

I don't want to think of people driving around with home-made gas tanks...

[dkjones96]

I'm not really trying to defend the people that drive fast but it's a matter of frame of reference really.

Take for example my car and a couple others. Stock I would only get about 25mpg at 75mph which is kinda poor for a 4 banger(turns 2850 at 75mph). I've taken trips in two cars that astounded me with their mileage. A grand marquis getting 28mpg averaging 85mph(turns 1900rpm at 85) and a corvette getting 27mpg averaging about 95-100 mph for a long few hour trip each way(turns around 1600rpm at 80mph).

If I was to sell my car and buy a corvette, I could not only get places WAY faster than I do now but still pay less at the pump and pollute less doing so assuming I don't drive longer distances.

Also take for example a person that owns a Ford 5.4L truck and gets around 18 on the freeway at 70-75 mph. If he was to sell his truck he doesn't need and go buy a new Civic Si he could go triple digit speeds and haul *** around town all day and probably never even kiss the mileage that truck got. So he's saving money by using less fuel than he was but he's tearing it up all over town.

Compare this guy with someone that drives an 80s corolla and retires it for a new car, this person goes out and buys the same Civic Si because he's wanted one and has a good job now, but is getting close to 10-15 mpg less than he used to driving the car easy.

Who is more in the wrong here? The guy that sold his truck but drives around like a bat out of hell all the time or the guy that got rid of his corolla to get a nice little civic that he babies all around town while getting worse mileage than he used to?

Everyone has their story. Hell, I've made my final decision as to what's replacing the tracker, I'll be getting an 08 Mustang GT during this next winter but it's not going to be my daily driver except for the winter months. The Rebel 250 I'm picking up in a couple weeks is. Yeah, the mustang averages 20-22mpg but the rebel I'll drive most of the time gets 65+mpg. Overall it'll be a gross reduction in consumption, especially after I move, but I've worked hard for what I have and I feel that the savings from the bike(40-45 more mpg) offset the 8-10mpg less mileage the pony will get while I'm at the drag strip or driving like a jerk off whenever I happen to be.

You'd look at me and say 'what a gross polluter, doesn't he care about the environment? stupid american' all without knowing that 90% of the time I'm driving a vehicle that stomps even your cars mileage by probably 2 fold. I haven't gotten it yet but you can bet i'll be hypermiling in that thing.

[R.I.D.E.]

DKJones aero the Rebel and get 100 MPG .

regards
gary

[suspendedhatch]

Don't give me that "I want to spend time with my family" nonsense. If you were thinking about your family you wouldn't be taking risks that could leave them without their parent. Speeding gets you there maybe 1 or 2 minutes faster AT MOST. Do you jog to and from your car? How much of that precious time do you spend sitting in front of the TV? How much time are you going to spend with your family if you get pulled over for a ticket, or worse, get in an accident?

I do the speed limit, maybe 5 mph over. Depends on the situation. Most of the time there's no benefit to speeding but I match the speed of traffic for safety reasons. Every day a few *******s speed and cut around me. I catch up to them at the light every time. I used to speed on long freeway trips, but these last few trips have taught me that if I do 70 vs 80, I make one less stop at the gas station, hence I GET THERE AT THE SAME TIME but with a couple more bucks in my bank account.

[fumesucker]

Originally Posted by dkjones96

I haven't gotten it yet but you can bet i'll be hypermiling in that thing.

I don't think you are going to be hypermiling on a 250 Rebel, they are fairly underpowered and you're more than likely going to be wringing its tail just to keep up with traffic.

I've had a number of small street bikes and the temptation to just beat the hell out of them is extremely difficult to overcome. My current FZR400 is just big enough to escape that fate, you can ride it conservatively and still more than keep up with traffic but its still small enough to handle extremely well and be very flickable.

Handling is way more important on a motorcycle than in a car, when you are on two wheels you want the most predictable handling you can get since your life could well depend on dodging the next cage that aims straight at you.

[EH3]

Originally Posted by suspendedhatch

Every day a few *******s speed and cut around me. I catch up to them at the light every time.

so true.

i use to drive 15-20mph over everywhere. i ripped on my car hard from stops and was never able to best 33mpg

i slowed down to 5mph over, i now consistenly get 40mpg with about 5mins extra driving time in thick traffic. no biggie.

[R.I.D.E.]

The world record for a 250 CC bike is something like 250 MPG. Aero improvements will give you better top end performance.

regards
gary

[Wazabi Owner]

After this evening's ride home, I hope gas goes to $6 a gallon OR they go ahead and pull that 55mph speed limit thing again - then actually have police enforce it. Heck, the extra cops used to enforce it could pay for themselves in a short time (at least in my area).

[R.I.D.E.]

They way they are slowing down here I would be there are a lot less tickets being issued. Last 45 miles trip west to Richmond there were 6 troopers trying to catch speeders on the interstate. Since only a few are going 75-80 they stand out in the crowd.

Kind of hard for a trooper to pick one out of a bumper to bumper crowd going 75-80 in a 65 zone. It's reckless over 80 here and I would bet they are all getting nailed with the $500 fine and 4 points.

regards
gary

[fumesucker]

Why pick 55?

Maybe the national speed limit should be 35, eh?

Save a lot of fuel and lives too..

Then, when we get used to that, we could drop the speed limit to 25.

With radar operated cameras *everywhere*, to make sure that we obey like good little sheeple should.

Very few people seem to know this, but "the land of the free" has a higher percentage of its citizens incarcerated than any other country on our planet.

One in every 100 Americans is in prison.

http://abcnews.go.com/TheLaw/wireStory?id=4359509

We're #1, and just to make sure we stay that way, we ought to work on making sure that we double the incarceration rate to 2 in every 100 citizens.

We could make anything over 50 mph into a felony.. That should do the trick.

[jadziasman]

From 1974 to 1987 the national speed limit was 55 mph. During the next 9 years federal speed limits disappeared and it was and is up to individual states to set their own limits.

I favor a reasonable speed limit (65 mph) with a minimum speed of 55. This way drivers who want to drive in the 55 to 65 mph range will be able to and those who want to drive 75 and over will need to make sure they can afford the points and fines they're liable to collect if local law enforcement wants to collect easy money from them.

[tjts1]

Originally Posted by fumesucker

Why pick 55?

Maybe the national speed limit should be 35, eh?

Why 35mph? Why not 15mph? Imagine how much fuel you could save with that national speed limit. Maybe we should make anything over 20mph a felony.

[R.I.D.E.]

The speed limit is a balancing act, too fast and you use significantly more fuel overall.

Too slow and your roads will be too crowded, if the same numebr of cars are on the road overall.

10 hours at 70=700 miles
10 hours at 55=550 miles

That leaves the same car on the road 70/55 longer which adds up to more congestion which will cause more problems in a snowball effect.

The optimal speed should be where the most cars get the best mileage probably 55-60. This is considering the congestion effect as an equal factor.

Anither consideration would be where the trucks get the best mileage.

regards
gary

[bowtieguy]

Originally Posted by tjts1

Why 35mph? Why not 15mph? Imagine how much fuel you could save with that national speed limit. Maybe we should make anything over 20mph a felony.

let's make burning fossil fuels a felony!

[monroe74]

Originally Posted by R.I.D.E.

Too slow and your roads will be too crowded, if the same numebr of cars are on the road overall.

You're overlooking the fact that there's an effect in the other direction. At lower speeds, stopping distances are reduced, which means the cars can be closer together. So at a given moment, a given mile of highway can have more cars on it, before being filled to capacity.

If you viewed the road from above, you would see more metal and less pavement. The line of cars would look more and more like a train.

[waddie]

Originally Posted by monroe74

If you viewed the road from above, you would see more metal and less pavement. The line of cars would look more and more like a train.

And less overall wind resistance.

[monroe74]

Originally Posted by waddie

And less overall wind resistance.

Good point, I didn't think of that. Overall efficiency would improve because vehicles closer together would tend to create more of a drafting effect.

[VetteOwner]

Originally Posted by theholycow

Ah, I love the closed minds. Sure, most people ARE stupid, but OTOH, some might get paid more per hour than driving slower saves, and some might be able to save a significant amount of time that they'd rather spend with their family (and are willing to purchase that time).

Nah most people are stupid...

and those people who you say can "buy" family time by speeding would rather be at work than at home earning more money to keep up their lifestyles. That and they would buy maybe minute of saved time by speeding...

People around here are still not going much faster than 55 on 55mph highways. Im going about 50-55 and sure Im getting past but their not whizzing by like they used to. Still get the uppity douche bags in the 4 ton SUV's and crappy driving soccer moms but they usually get boxed in so they cant go much more than 55 lol

[fumesucker]

When cars are closer together, the "accordion" effect becomes more pronounced. Speed up, then slow down to a crawl or even a complete stop.

From what I understand, the mathematics of this are very complex and not at all well understood. I do know from my own observations that the closer together the cars are on the highway, the more likely this is to happen..

The "accordion" effect is extremely inefficient and fuel could be saved by higher speed travel that does not vary a great deal.

[theholycow]

Originally Posted by VetteOwner

That and they would buy maybe minute of saved time by speeding...

10% increase in average speed on a 100 minute daily commute would be 10 minutes bought. 20mph over 55 (75 being a common speed for speeders on 55mph highways) is about 40% over, and covers for time spent at traffic lights that can't go any faster, easily making a 10% increase in average speed. My commute is a little more than 100 minutes daily. Those are more realistic numbers than "maybe [one] minute".

Originally Posted by fumesucker

From what I understand, the mathematics of this are very complex and not at all well understood. I do know from my own observations that the closer together the cars are on the highway, the more likely this is to happen..

Interesting reading on this:
http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/amateur.../traffic1.html

[monroe74]

"Interesting reading"

Excellent link, thanks.

[fumesucker]

Originally Posted by theholycow

Interesting reading on this:
http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/amateur.../traffic1.html

I read that a while back, it is indeed interesting.