Ford model T FE

[Greybrick]

Not a trick question and I don't know the answer but was wondering if any know what the fuel economy of a Ford Model T was about 100 years ago or a Model A was about 80 years ago and aside from some improved emissions how much we have progressed from that.

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[VetteOwner]

well what ive heard is the model T nowadays average gets around low 20's

model A's nowadays get averages of around 22-25.

the model T never had front brakes, it was rear brakes only and a 2 speed transmission.

btw a fun fact is the model A engine made about 35hp. and has a 4:1 compression ratio.

so really weve gotten slightly better mpg but 10X more power, less weight, higher revs, etc

[101mpg]

The Model T got about 25 MPG, and the Model A got around 30 MPG, but on TODAY's gasoline they get closer to about 25. Gasoline then was a significantly different compositionl.

I recall that in 2004 when Ford had its 100th anniversary, the average fleet got LESS MPG than in 1904.

The Model T was originally designed to run on straight alcohol. Literally it would run on moonshine!

[VetteOwner]

Originally Posted by 101mpg

The Model T got about 25 MPG, and the Model A got around 30 MPG.

I recall that in 2004 when Ford had its 100th anniversary, the average fleet got LESS MPG than in 1904.

The Model T was originally designed to run on straight alcohol. Literally it would run on moonshine!

its true henry did envision cars running on pure what we call today ethonal or grain alcohal.

and if you think about it during the depression theres storys where they would literally use moonshine to get the ol car runnin.

im restoring my great grandpas 1929 ford model AA truck so ive found a few forums about the model A. someone did a survey and the average mpg was about what i said mid 20's. some were as low as mid teens some were in the upper 20's low 30's. in those cars its all in how you drive and how well you can set the spark advance precisely to make the engien run most efficient.

[101mpg]

Nice to see real-world results! BTW I was writing my post as you were writing yours - there were no replies when I started my post. Wasn't trying to correct your information, was just writing what I knew.

You should tell people about your restoration project on here! It would be really fun.

My neighbor across the road is working on a 1952 truck right now - stripped down to the bare frame, fixing it up to like new condition. He's always in that garage fixing something. I enjoy walking over and saying hi to watch what he's doing from time to time. I bet that our members would like to know how your project goes too!

[R.I.D.E.]

I had a 37 Ford 5 window coupe, original 95 horse flathead, original 6 volt, original cable brakes. Had it up to 82 MPH once (speed limit in VA was 35 in 37).
It got about 20 MPG. They actaully reduced the carb venturi size when they went from the Stromberg 48 to the 97 in 37. 7.5 to 1 compression was highest of any factory flathead.

Tetraethyl lead was one of America's secret weapons in WW2, allowing the US to extract more power from the same size engines as our enemies. After the war the leaded fuels allowed much higher compression that the Model T or A. The flathead engine design doesn't make it easy to reduce the combustion chamber area without affecting the air flow around the valves.

The 37 was an easy car to drive in traffic, as long as you watched out for the moron who pulled over in front of you and slammed on the brakes. I used a digital thermometer to balance the brake adjustments by reading the temp of each drum. I could stop the car with thumb pressure on the pedal.

Not exactly the topic but I thought it might be interesting. Idle speed was 350 anad the car would pull from 7 mph easily in top gear. Redline was 3800.

regards
gary

[baddog671]

The model T's didnt weigh much at all, did they? I mean, they were pretty much wood and very very...compact(not the word im looking for)

[VetteOwner]

Originally Posted by baddog671

The model T's didnt weigh much at all, did they? I mean, they were pretty much wood and very very...compact(not the word im looking for)

yea they were light compared to todays cars, and back then they were seen as a tool, a thing to get you to the store and church, not some "im better than you" driveable trophy. The model T and A were pretty basic cars for thier time (in today it would be like a base metro VS ohh any midsized car)

yes they had alot of wood, but wood was WAY cheaper than metal back then hence why he could sell em for $500, lots of cars for that period had wood in them. yes the cab/bodys weren't huge at all but gotta remember people didn't know what center armrests were, and virtually noone was obese. you are sitting leg to leg to your passengers...

haha yea 101 i noticed that last night, i posted then said someone replied already

ill do a write up on it with a buncha pictures and a video of the engine running

[R.I.D.E.]

The 37 was 2500 pounds, with a 223 CI V8.

regards
gary

[VetteOwner]

i do know the model A engine and tranny together weigh about 500 lbs, all iron and steel!!!

[Powerstroke IN]

Another fun fact. The Model T was designed to run on Ethanol. And now, 100 years later, it's NEW technology? Sheesh...

[jcp123]

T hot rods weigh in at around 12-1500lbs, so full-dress maybe 1700lbs? They ran with a little 20hp flathead four, mileage was probably around 25ish. The compression, as mentioned, was exceptionally low which allowed it to run on just about anything that was flammable and have that super low idle speed. Incidentally, they were our first SUV's - paved roads virtually didn't exist in the T's first days, so it had to be able to traverse dirt roads, berms, mud, and anything else that was out there.

Incidentally I saw a T hot rod today - running a Lincoln OHV V8, presumably the 317.

[JoeBob]

Had a good friend in high school back in the early '70s who used to like to take his VW down dirt roads that his other friends couldn't (or were afraid to) travel. The only other person in that group who could keep up with him was a kid who had a '27 Model T.

Regarding weight of these cars...

Don't know what the regulation is now, but "back in the day" if a car weighed over 1500 lbs it required fenders. Most Model T (and model A, for that matter) hot rods came in under this even with V8s, etc. That is why they were able to run w/o fenders. This would indicate that these were pretty light-weight cars.

[VetteOwner]

model T's and A's left the factory with fenders.

i do know my AA truck weighs pretty close to 2 tons... but its got a huge steel bed on it, bigger frame , bigger solid metal wheels, bigger axels, etc.

[Powerstroke IN]

Originally Posted by JoeBob

Had a good friend in high school back in the early '70s who used to like to take his VW down dirt roads that his other friends couldn't (or were afraid to) travel. The only other person in that group who could keep up with him was a kid who had a '27 Model T.

Regarding weight of these cars...

Don't know what the regulation is now, but "back in the day" if a car weighed over 1500 lbs it required fenders. Most Model T (and model A, for that matter) hot rods came in under this even with V8s, etc. That is why they were able to run w/o fenders. This would indicate that these were pretty light-weight cars.

Well if you consider the "roads" the Model T had to travel, that is no suprise. Volkswagons were designed to be able to navigate the heavy snows of Germany with ease, and the Model T had to negotiate roads that horse had o travel. Some of the best off road vehicles made, in my humble opinion...

[Powerstroke IN]

Originally Posted by VetteOwner

model T's and A's left the factory with fenders.

i do know my AA truck weighs pretty close to 2 tons... but its got a huge steel bed on it, bigger frame , bigger solid metal wheels, bigger axels, etc.

Want my advice? I don't know what kind of budget you have, but I would personally try to build an aluminum frame and outfit it with as many fiber glass body panels as I could. Of course, I have a lot of aluminum fabriction ecperience, and my dad was an aiplane mechanic, so he could make almost anything out of fiber glass. Materials are less expensive than labor. Just a suggestion. Considering the eficiency of early motors (SUPRISE!!!), a 1-2K lb weight savings couls be the ticket...

[theholycow]

Originally Posted by JoeBob

Had a good friend in high school back in the early '70s who used to like to take his VW down dirt roads that his other friends couldn't (or were afraid to) travel. The only other person in that group who could keep up with him was a kid who had a '27 Model T.

That reminds me of off-roading in my '87 Cadillac. For a large low-slung FWD sedan, I sure got it to do some rough off-roading...

[VetteOwner]

Originally Posted by Powerstroke IN

Want my advice? I don't know what kind of budget you have, but I would personally try to build an aluminum frame and outfit it with as many fiber glass body panels as I could. Of course, I have a lot of aluminum fabriction ecperience, and my dad was an aiplane mechanic, so he could make almost anything out of fiber glass. Materials are less expensive than labor. Just a suggestion. Considering the eficiency of early motors (SUPRISE!!!), a 1-2K lb weight savings couls be the ticket...

I can buy fiberglass fenders and such but in the big scheme of things theres really no point. Sure it will be light but the current gear/tranny setup i will have a cruising speed of 35-40mph. BUT have the ability to go up a tree if i wanted to also have the 1 1/2 ton load capacity

aluminum is expensive as hell and would deffinetly not be worth the trouble since theres crucial parts integrated into the frame...

im planning to keep it as stock looking as possible. By that i mean original looking body pannels, engine/tranny, and the look of it, but im going to add safety features like seatbelts, safety glass (windows are plate glass ) adding a right side taillight and making an amber LED board to attach to the back (prolly by C-clamps) so when im driving on the highway putting along at 35-40mph i wont get rear ended...

[JoeBob]

Sounds like a night back when I was much younger...after WAAAAAY too many beers...piling a bunch of us into first, a Mazda RX-2 then later into a 1959 Dodge and going dirt-roading around Twentynine Palms...amazing either car (or us) survived! Although the Mazda's clutch did slip a lot afterwards...

The next day, I pulled up to a friend's place to drop off another friend...says he: "Your car smells like a big beer!"

Originally Posted by theholycow

That reminds me of off-roading in my '87 Cadillac. For a large low-slung FWD sedan, I sure got it to do some rough off-roading...